[TROM1] Replay B48

Ant Phillips ivy at post8.tele.dk
Fri Jan 4 14:44:14 UTC 2008



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Previously sent:
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 11:35:41 +0100
Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2001 19:45:16 +0200
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2002 00:04:00 +0100
Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:25:00 +0100
Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2005 20:35:31 +0100
Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 08:06:11 +0200


Subject:               TROM: Replay B48
Date:               Fri, 13 Nov 1998 20:21:38 +0100
From:               Antony Phillips <ivy at post8.tele.dk>
Organization:               International Viewpoints
To:               trom-l at newciv.org


(regret, have not got round to doing anything about the last request -
The files need the text formatting commands for Ventura taken out.)
Hi,  Ant
--
        Ant                                Antony A Phillips
        ivy at post8.tele.dk
                                          tlf: (+45) 45 88 88 69
                                           Box 78
                                           DK - 2800 Lyngby
Editor, International Viewpoints (= IVy). See Home Page:
http://home8.inet.tele.dk/ivy/
Administrator: trom-l, selfclearing-l, superscio-l, IVy lists


       Subject:               TROM -from the Pilot
          Date:               Sat, 24 Jan 1998 21:27:28 +0100
         From:               Antony Phillips <ivy at post8.tele.dk>
Organization:               International Viewpoints
            To:               trom-l at newciv.org


[
The Pilot is a prolific write, and I can not keep up with him.  So any
one spotting any of his writings to do with TROM, should please repost
to this list.  Possibly the best place to keep an eye on him is to check
in with free Zone America Home Page http://fza.org
and get on their Pilot mailing list.
I did howvver find the following (only the part to do with TROM pasted
here).
--
        Ant                                Antony A Phillips
        ivy at post8.tele.dk   (trom-l administrator)

==========================================

subj : Super Scio Tech - Answering Donald on Trom Etc.


ANSWERING DONALD ON TROM ETC.


On 11 Jan 98, Donald Shimoda <"bnb"@(remove)best.com>
wrote on subject "QUESTIONS FOR THE PILOT"

 > Dear Pilot
 >
 >     Thank you for sharing your experiences with us through your books.
 > Your time was well spent. I agree that our universe IS nothing but a
 > wave of the hand.
 >
 >    Since we haven't spoken before I thought I would give you some
 > information on myself and my relation to the Church of Scientology. I
 > started in 1980 and have had many major cognition's and case gains by
 > applying  LRHs Tech. and actually went Clear  by myself while at home. I
 > think my Cert # is fourteen thousand something as of a 1982 DCSI.
 >
 >     Really wasn't trying to clear myself at the time but I was
 > contemplating the past and suddenly  blew enough charge to power a major
 > American city for at least a hundred years or so and continued cogniting
 > for the next year after.

Excellent.

 >      However, I did read hours and hours of LRH HCOBs , books and tapes
 > in and out of the Orgs. prior to going clear mainly out of fascination
 > after going full blown keyed out Theta Clear exterior on the $80.00
 > Success Through Communication course offered in  Div 6. This was the
 > first course I took.
 >
 >     I would not have gone Clear by myself without  this LRH dude and the
 > thousands of hours of he put into the Tech.. I am indebted forever.  All
 > the money in the Universe couldn't repay the debt. Actually money has
 > nothing to do with it .
 >
 >     I too have knowingly violated physical universe laws with and
 > without witnesses while being exterior . It made no difference to me who
 > was present while violating.
 >
 >     At one time I paid some attention to this guy who watched me float
 > an aluminum ladder to the ground from about 2 feet in the air. He
 > watched and promptly went into a not is on it kind of look and continued
 > on with his day.

Again excellent.

 >   So... a couple of questions if you would please.
 >
 >  1) TROM tech.    Do you have any reality with this ?
 >    It is at http://fza.org/trom/index.phtml and seems to be a direct
 > method.

I picked it up when they made it available recently.  I did a
quick read of it and tried the processes with some benifit although
I didn't do a thorough run.  I would say that I'm more of a
dilletant rather than an expert in it at this point, but I do
have some observations and opinions.

Its nicely written and he does a good job of explaining some basics.

I consider it to be a sequel to some things from the research
line of the late 1950s and it is pretty much in the late 50s
style although it has a bit of later stuff.  Ron left many loose
ends and abandoned research lines and it is good to see them
followed up on.  My own tendency is to follow up on things left
hanging from the early 1950s (1952-4).

There was such a wealth of things opened up in those early days
and unfortunately it was a one man show instead of an association
of researchers pursuing all the paths in parallel.

My only objection to it is that the array of processes and the
areas handled are too narrow.  Which is not a problem as long
as you don't do it exclusively.

It might be right as a first action for some people.  Others might
find that it is worth their time at some point in their development,
such as between passes of the self clearing book.

If it seems to indicate as the right action, go ahead and run it.

I do think, however, that if somebody grinds along with it too
long it will begin to bypass charge on other areas of the case.
But that is true of lots of tech.

==============================0




Subject:          Re:TROM IS GREAT
    Date:          Tue, 27 Jan 1998 10:01:34 -0800
   From:          "MICHAEL W. BONNYCASTLE" <bcastle at SoCA.com>
      To:          BNB at BEST.COM
     CC:          trom-l at newciv.org


Hi Randy,                                              1/27/98

Yes, Trom is wonderful and I can really look on it as a very
important postulate one had made coming to pass(finding it).  The other
great thing, as you  mentioned, it very quickly gave me a strong reality of
the
FreeZone.  But even on staff the idea that the COS was the ONLY place one
could avail  himself to clearing tech seemed ridiculous and in fact
toward the end
                  I was considering how one could be causative over their SCN
future outside of staff or COS.  What I am finding very interesting about
Trom at this point is ones ability to change, examine their basic
considerations has increased remarkably.  Specifically, considerations
regarding personal causativeness.  I can see where training, data, 
communication
would really be fuel for ones growth at this point.  I ran across this
interesting excerpt from Bob Ross this weekend:

                      Two specific assertions of great importance in making
conditions persist are assertions of Rightness and denials of
rightness or making things or others wrong, also known as
invalidation.  Asserting or proclaiming Rightness provides justification for
having a thought  and so reduces ones own causativeness by assigning cause
to what one  has considered right instead of to oneself.
                          Invalidating a thought or accepting invalidation of a
thought denies that thought and tries to make it not be, while
continuing to  create it.  This empowers the suppression/and or
suppressor who is blamed, and assigns causativeness to that supressor.
                          Peeling off assertions of rightness and invalidations
helps to restore personal causativeness and responsibility for and
over one's own thoughts.  One may be invalidated or made wrong by
others, but what harms people most is making themselves wrong for
whatever reason.
                          Assigning judgments of importance and unimportance
are two more ways to lessen one's own causativeness, as doing so,
assigns cause to other than self.
                          At a level of total cause over one's own life,
importance and unimportance exist only by assignment of the person
making the judgement and persist until the person changes his mind.

                 I liked the emphasis there on the reduction of causativeness.
This  truth, for me, exposes the lie, that the assigning of
importance(i.e. blame, regret) is a big trap in itself that undermines
personal
causation.
                 Sounds like you are really having some great wins, that's
great, I'd like to hear more.  You should have received your tape by now as I
sent it   last week, did you?

                       Best Regards,

                              Michael


     Subject:
             Re: TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM
             TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM TROM
       Date:             Wed, 28 Jan 1998 07:28:27 -0800
       From:             "MICHAEL W. BONNYCASTLE" <bcastle at SoCA.com>
         To:             Donald Shimoda <D_Shimoda at hotmail.com>
         CC:             trom-l at newciv.org
References:             1 , 2


Hi!
 >
 > Who's Bob Ross ?
Bob is a veteran SCN auditor and
researcher since 1950.  He did the SHSBC when Ron was doing it live at Saint
Hill and was on
staff with  the COS until he left in 1983.  He is still active in
auditing and researching the subject(polishing, refining, searching)
and lives in  Pasadena.  I went to see him for a session recently.
 > Its always been a consideration and only a consideration but I didn't
realize it before and now I am
 > getting back my consideration control.    Yes, that's great.
It seems really worthwhile to take a moment to
                     noticing these things in ourselves too.
 > Its kind of like being surprised everyday. What will tomorrow bring ? What
will I realize tomorrow?
 > Its amazing how rapid a case can move.                    It's really an
adventure, isn't it.  There are times when I think 'O.K.,
                     it's all coming to a plateau now' but I continue on the
next day and
                     keep gaining, cleaning it up more.
 > MICHAEL W. BONNYCASTLE wrote:
 >
 > > Hi Donald,                                              1/27/98
 > >
 > >                  Yes, Trom is wonderful and I can really look on 
it as a very important
 > >                  postulate one had made coming to pass(finding 
it).  The other great thing, as you
 > >                  mentioned, it very quickly gave me a strong 
reality of the FreeZone.  But
 > >                  even on staff the idea that the COS was the 
ONLY place one could avail
 > >                  himself to clearing tech seemed ridiculous and 
in fact toward the end
 > >                  I was considering how one could be causative 
over their SCN future outside
 > >                  of staff or COS.  What I am finding very 
interesting about Trom at this
 > >                  point is ones ability to change, examine their 
basic considerations has
 > >                  increased remarkabley.  Specifically, 
considerations regarding personal
 > >                  causativeness.  I can see where training, data, 
communication would really
 > >                  be fuel for ones growth at this point.  I ran 
across this interesting
 > >                  excerpt from Bob Ross this weekend:
 > >
 > >                      Two specific assertions of great importance 
in making conditions
 > >                      persist are assertions of Rightness and 
denials of rightness or
 > >                      making things or others wrong, also known 
as invalidation.  Asserting
 > >                      or proclaiming Rightness provides 
justification for having a thought
 > >                      and so reduces ones own causativeness by 
assigning cause to what one
 > >                      has considered right instead of to oneself.
 > >                          Invalidating a thought or accepting 
invalidation of a thought
 > >                      denies that thought and tries to make it 
not be, while continuing to
 > >                      create it.  This empowers the 
suppression/and or suppressor who is
 > >                      blamed, and assigns causativeness to that supressor.
 > >                          Peeling off assertions of rightness an 
invalidations helps to
 > >                      restore personal causativeness and 
resposibility for and over one's
 > >                      own thoughts.  One may be invalidated or 
made wrong by others, but
 > >                      what harms people most is making themselves 
wrong for whatever reason.
 > >                          Assigning judgments of importance and 
unimportance are two more
 > >                      ways to lessen one's own causativeness, as 
doing so, assigns cause to
 > >                      other than self.
 > >                          At a level of total cause over one's 
own life, importance and
 > >                      unimportance exist only by assignment of 
the person making the
 > >                      judgement and persist until the person 
changes his mind.
 > >
 > >                 I liked the emphasis there on the reduction of 
causativeness.  This
 > >                 truth, for me, exposes the lie, that the 
assigning of importance(i.e. blame,
 > >                 regret) is a big trap in itself that undermines 
personal causation.
 > >                 Sounds like you are really having some great 
wins, that's great, I'd like
 > >                 to hear more.  You should have received your 
tape by now as I sent it
 > >                 last week, did you?
 > >
 > >                       Best Regards,
 > >
 > >                              Michael


Subject:          TROM-L
    Date:          Wed, 28 Jan 1998 19:39:05 -0800
   From:          Randy Nicholson <bnb at best.com>
      To:          "ivy at post8.tele.dk" <ivy at post8.tele.dk>


Hello
Anthony,



It would be great if you would ..........
Please post these articals to trom-l

Thank you
Randy Nicholson

Burtles, Britta        ... Dennis Stephens' "Ron in the 1950's"       25 34 96
Gordon, Frank        ... Dennis Stephens' "Ron in the 50's" (2)     26 32 96
                               No Games Condition
(picture)                       11 01 93
Pearcy, Ralph        No-games
conditions                                    29 33 96
Ross, Bob
TROM                                                          21 30 95
Methven, Judith        TROM, Further comment on                       33 45 97
Methven, Judith         TROM, Report 
on                                    21 31 95
Gordon, Frank           TROM: A better bridge? 31 29 97
Andersen, Judith     TROM, What is 
?                                        26 09 96
Andersen, Judith     What is 
TROM?                                           26 09 96
Anderson, Judith     Aust & NZ Clearing Conference nov 1996     30 32 97

Anderson, Judith     Objectives
(4)                                               35 42 98
Funch, Flemming      TROM: Similarities & Difference                  28 38 96
Dunn, Leonard        TROM - book 
review                                   19 27 94
Stephens, Dennis H   Reminiscences of Ron - 1                         18 25 94
Stephens, Dennis H   Reminiscences of Ron - 2                         22 09 95
Stephens, Dennis H   Reminiscences of Ron - 4                         24 08 95
Stephens, Dennis H   Ron comes to England 18 25 94
Stephens, Dennis H   Ron in the 
1950's                                       22 09 95
Stephens, Dennis H   TROM's level 5, A tape of 34 29 97
Stephens, Dennis H   TROM, The Creation of 17 23 94
Stephens, Dennis H.  More of the 
50's                                        24 08 95



--
        Ant                                Antony A Phillips
        ivy at post8.tele.dk
                                          tlf: (+45) 45 88 88 69
                                          Jerrrnbanevej 3f, 4 th
                                          DK - 2800 Lyngby
Editor, International Viewpoints (= IVy). See Home Page:
http://www.ivymag.org
Administrator: trom-l, selfclearing-l, superscio-l,
previous-life-scio and IVy lists
--
Antony Phillips.
ant.phillips at post8.tele.dk
(+45) 45 88 88 69 



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